And then... Basically out of the blue, this happened.
What you're about to read is not really a "conversation", but we'll call it that for the sake of the blog post. I haven't engaged people in this way in a very long time online (mostly because I'm just too damn busy and it's not worth my limited time to do), but I will say this... it's pretty representative of every other time I've unearthed a communist on the internet.
The following is the uncut exchange beginning with the very first comment Mimi wrote through the last thing she said after I decided to leave the conversation. I've altered nothing, and I can assure you there was no baiting in my previous posts.
Enjoy:
- Sean Malone Totallly Socialism is a winner... at killing people.
http://www.units.muohio.edu/havighurstcenter/themes/gulag/images/montana_de_cadaveres_en_un_gulag_sovietico.jpg
- Mimi Poposka lol yes and thats why the US killed 3 million Vietnamese and installed the 'containment strategy'
- Mimi Poposka You are just a typical American brainwashed lemming if you can't see what the US has done around the world ... The single largest terrorist country in the world
- Sean Malone 1. I don't support that strategy, so... what's your point?
2. That pales in comparison to the nearly 50 million killed by Mao. Or the hundred+ million socialist regimes have accomplished. - Sean Malone Yes. I'm clearly brainwashed because you invented a position for me to agree with (which I don't) so you could argue with me.
- Mimi Poposka Oh not to mention toppled democratically elected presidents all over the world and invaded Iraq for its oil resulting in the aggregate death of over 1 million innocent ppl
- Sean Malone Yeah. Again. I'm well aware of all of that and don't disagree with criticizing American foreign policy on any of those grounds. That actually doesn't change the fact that the record of socialism is literally about a hundred times worse... and that it's a system which creates the worst inequities and poverty mankind can experience.
If you think that what you're doing is offering a counter argument, then I'm sorry, but... you're not. - Mimi Poposka You are just a typical foxnews fool, but guess what ...the Chinese economy is about to overtake the US by 2020 and you will soon lose your superpower status
- Sean Malone "You are just a typical foxnews fool, but guess what ...the Chinese economy is about to overtake the US by 2020 and you will soon lose your superpower status"
Oh jesus... That's hilarious. On every level possible. - Mimi Poposka I support socialism as its based on sound reasoning, science and is the ONLY sustainable socio-economic system
- Sean Malone Noooooooooo.... that definitely wouldn't be true, since there is nothing remotely "sound" about the reasoning for socialism. Nor is it remotely sustainable - as we've seen countless times in world history. And of course, it's obviously unsustainable, as it amounts to a system that is built around poor incentives which encourage over-consumption and discourage production.
- Mimi Poposka Forgive me 2026 lol I made a 6 year error lolhttp://citywire.co.uk/money/goldman-sachs-china-to-overtake-us-economy-in-2026/a550329
- Sean Malone "MY" alternative is freedom.
Something that you're clearly unprepared to even have a dialogue about, given your inability to even discuss these kinds of issues without STARTING at an ad hominem place. - Sean Malone And two points about China.
1. It's only improved after moving AWAY from socialism, and...
2. It's not nearly so rosey a picture as you're pretending. China is pretty unlikely to overtake anything until it deals with it's serious lack of economic and social freedoms.
It's funny that you're a big fan though considering that it's actively moving away from the policies you support. - Sean Malone Mimi. I'm sorry, you're not remotely worth my time today. If you'd started out by having a dialogue rather than with ad homs and strawmen, then maybe you would have been... but it's going to take way too much time to even begin to get through to you and I've learned that lesson too many times already to continue.
- Mimi Poposka Which economic system do you prescribe to and if you dont have an answer then why are you talking out of your ass ?
- Sean Malone I'm not the one "talking out of my ass", Mimi. I just happen to think your'e far too angry, ignorant and dense to actually have a conversation with.
- Mimi Poposka you can not even tell me which socio-economic system you prescribe to ...so you are actually not worth talking to
- Sean Malone Of course I can. I would support a true free market built around clear private property, social & economic freedom (i.e. freedom to choose what to do with your body, time and stuff without the interference of the state forcing you to do something else) and mutually beneficial contractual agreements (i.e. trade) being the standard interaction between people.
Peace, voluntary trade, markets, freedom. - Mimi Poposka a loser just like her who in the end actually took social security benefits when all along preached against it
- Sean Malone Oh. Ok... I must be a "Right wing libertarian piece of shit" then, that's certainly a good argument for why I should actually bother to engage in conversation with you.
- Sean Malone Remember when I said you're not remotely worth my time because you're incapable of having an intelligent dialogue? Yeah. That.
- Mimi Poposka Freedom means having healthcare education and food ... it means we all help one another and equally share the burdens we encounter
- Sean Malone That is explicitly NOT what "freedom" means. But feel free to try again when you can not only use words accurately, but when you can do so without automatically calling your "opponent" the worst names you can think of.
- Mimi Poposka I hate Ayn Rand types so forgive me for not being able to stand your idiotic rant when you obviously lack the logic and education to have an opinion and need to go back to the Tea bagging you came from
- Sean Malone 1. Not really an "Ayn Rand type".
2. Didn't go on an "idiotic rant"... you did that.
3. I have clearly demonstrated more knowledge and logic than you on just this thread.
4. Not a "tea bagger".
...anything else you can get wrong today? Or.... Are you just going to keep assuming you know what everyone else thinks without bothering to listen to them or even ask any questions you want an answer to? - Sean Malone Who gives a shit whether or not Ayn Rand got social security, by the way?
1. She opposed the program, but that didn't matter since she had money stolen from her all her life to pay for it and it would have actually been against her philosophy to NOT get that money back.
2. What does that have to do with anything? - Sean Malone Actually I told you exactly which I'd support. Perhaps you missed it when you were busy calling me more names.
- Mimi Poposka You need to do a lot more reading in order to come to a proper educated and informed opinion
- Mimi Poposka then you need to understand the theory and learn some world history ...after this we can have a proper conversation
- Sean Malone "firstly you need to research all systems objectively"
HAHAHAHAHA holy shit... did you really just say this unironically? Oh. My. God. That was amazing. - Mimi Poposka i have a finance degree and a postgrad .... how can i talk about anything with you on this topic?
- Sean Malone Oh. Yeah, therefore I don't know anything. Got it. Couldn't be that I've spent about 10 years working with economists and philosophers and political theorists or have any knowledge at all.
- Sean Malone Your problems of "getting into depth" are not built around my non-existent ignorance of the ideas or world history you presume to condescend to me about. I have ample knowledge of both having debated these things almost 15 years now.
Your problem is that you have no interest in a rational, intelligent or honest conversation, and instead prefer to ASSUME you know what I think, and then call me names based on not only your assumptions about me, but your anger towards ideas you don't understand.
And now you have an obsession with labels that doesn't even make any sense. - Sean Malone Yes. For a policy organization and other organizations that do economics and public policy research, but even if that wasn't true, I still could know as much or more than you about these topics.
- Mimi Poposka yes you could know much more than me who dedicated a decade to political theory and ran my own international affairs hub for 6 years and has a finance degree and a postgrad in public policy ... sure you americans know it all from foxnews
- Mimi Poposka and let me ask you which journals do u subscribe to and read for your indepth political analysis ?
Now.... I should have probably completely stopped interacting earlier, but honestly, I'm intrigued by the existence of people like this.
You'll notice that there's absolutely no intellectual humility, no desire or willingness to discuss or engage on ideas, there's a focus only on labels over substance, inventing litmus tests and bare assertions of authority in Mimi's posts... All while her actual arguments are nothing but crass ad hominems and strawmen.
At no point does she seem to genuinely want to know what I actually think - or why - and instead, she's perfectly happy to call me an "Ayn Randian Right wing libertarian piece of shit".
Now... She's not interested in telling me why I'm wrong, either. All she does is tell me that I am wrong, and that I am obviously a "brainwashed lemming", a "foxnews fool", and - my favorite common refrain from people who can't defend their positions with reason or evidence - just a "media producer" who couldn't possibly know anything about anything. Then there's the bizarre dragging of Ayn Rand (who I did not mention one time) and her acceptance of social security and medicare into the discussion, even though that had nothing to do with anything.
In truth, sometimes I find myself lowering myself to the level of these people (although I rarely ever initiate this kind of tone), but mostly I find this to be really amusing. A woman who claims to have a "finance degree and a postgrad in public policy" cannot have a remotely rational discussion about economics and public policy.
Is it sad? Embarrassing? Maybe it's just predictable...
I don't know anymore, and although I hate to say it, this the whole thing is exceptionally common in my discussions with socialists and communists and has been for years.
I really don't know how they manage to make it through academic programs in public policy or finance or anything else. It seriously just makes me suspect that the majority of academic programs are simply echo-chambers utterly devoid of emphasis on critical thinking and formal (or even informal) logic.
For years I spent a lot of time debating with people about these kinds of things. I've mostly stopped doing that at this point in my life, because of experiences like this.
3 comments:
Mr. Malone,
I am a random guy who reads your blog occasionally because I bookmarked it years ago after seeing it linked somewhere (don't remember). I like your writing style, and I like your unique insights regarding the film and media industries and political intersections therewith.
But copying an argument from Facebook and appealing for support is a low-quality post! Why bother? The world is replete with morons of all stripes, including many on all sides of major social/political divides. I can only assume that you engage with such idiots regularly, as do most of us. I don't find it interesting to read the details of your protracted comment battle with someone who didn't know what they were talking about.
Yet curiously, the only time you comment is to tell me what you find uninteresting?
As it happens, though, I actually quit engaging with these kinds of idiots a while ago and this was the first time in quite a while that I've had that kind of protracted conversation. I was more a reminder than anything else.
Yes, I realize that it's odd to only comment on an article I find uninteresting. However, I think that constructive criticism of a bland article might be more helpful than simply saying "good article!" or "couldn't agree more!". Overall, this is a nice blog, you should be proud. Most of my non-commenting stems from the fact that I only very occasionally visit, skim through a few posts and see what sticks. Thanks for putting this stuff out there, even if it's unclear where it's ending up or who's reading.
I'm in Louisville, KY by the way.
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